Reatta Aircon

[libstainedglass]

What I didn't put in the last message is that I can't see an "E" in the "ECM Diagnostic Code" table.

[Ronnie]

 

1 hour ago, libstainedglass said:

What I can't do is locate the power steering pressure switch but I've only tried to see it from the top.

You can see it from the top on the passenger side.

 

 

[Ronnie]

1 hour ago, libstainedglass said:

Only difficulty for me is that I don't understand what  "comments" means exactly.

The comments section of the chart is just telling you what to expect to see when a particular code is set.  For instance it will tell you if a code will display a warning message on the dash. Not all codes will display a warning and you won't know they are present until you check diagnostics  Other comments will tell you or how the code might effect engine operation.

[libstainedglass]

OK......Thank you for the photographs of the power steering switch. New low pressure switch not arrived yet.

Disconnected battery to clear codes (codes don't clear through the diagnostics).

Shorted out the power steering switch connector, reconnected battery, set ES06 to "on" and started engine.

Pressed "Auto" on Climate control, set temp to 65 and blower fan starts and it continues to run indicating "auto".

Can hear AC relay chattering in underhood relay centre and I swapped relays around but still chatters on and off.

Compressor clutch not engaging, disconnect low pressure switch and clutch cycles on and off every few seconds.

Not really getting any colder inside car. Reconnect power steering switch and  AC changes to "econ".

Do I need a new power steering switch?

If so, should I get freon charge rechecked before it arrives or wait until I've replaced it?

Going back to yesterday's messages about the Chart of ECM diagnostic codes given to epssax, I still can't see where "E" is on the "diagnostic code comments" and it might be very relevant to my problem as it refers to "switches climate control "econ" if in "auto".

I really do appreciate everyone's help with this.

Best Regards, Paul.

 

[2seater]

I am a little out of my depth commenting on an a/c system but unless the system is drained, evacuated and refilled from scratch, I don't believe the refrigerant level can be checked without the compressor operational. Even refilling an empty system requires the compressor to operate at some point. I am unclear as to disconnecting the refrigerant pressure switch; did you install a jumper in the plug? A rapidly cycling compressor usually indicates an undercharge condition but if the pressure switch is bypassed it should force it to run?? A chattering relay is a new one to me but since you swapped relays and it continued, something seems to be going on with whatever controls the relay. I will endeavor to look through my FSM to see what I can find.

[2seater]

I looked in my '90 FSM and the ECM code chart is somewhat different. I took a few quick shots of what I felt are relevant pages. Pardon the quality.

[Ronnie]

2 hours ago, libstainedglass said:

Shorted out the power steering switch connector, reconnected battery, set ES06 to "on" and started engine.

Pressed "Auto" on Climate control, set temp to 65 and blower fan starts and it continues to run indicating "auto".

Can hear AC relay chattering in underhood relay centre and I swapped relays around but still chatters on and off.

Compressor clutch not engaging, disconnect low pressure switch and clutch cycles on and off every few seconds.

Not really getting any colder inside car. Reconnect power steering switch and  AC changes to "econ".

Do I need a new power steering switch?

If so, should I get freon charge rechecked before it arrives or wait until I've replaced it?

It seems odd that the compressor would start cycling when you disconnect the Low Pressure Switch. Did you mean connect it or did you put a jumper on it?

 

At this point I would leave the jumper on the power steering pressure switch until you get the AC working and then determine if a new switch is needed.

 

The next step for me would be to get the proper amount of freon in the system. That might require a jumper the Low Pressure Switch to keep the compressor from cycling while you are adding freon.  As 2seater said, you must have the compressor running when you are adding freon.  Once you have the proper amount of freon in the system you might find that you don't need a new Low Pressure Switch.

 

When you get the AC cooling correctly you can reconnect the power steering switch and if the AC quits working you should replace that switch.

[libstainedglass]

Ok...I'll jump the power steering switch again, fit the new low pressure switch when it arrives, get the system re-gassed and reassess the power steering switch afterwards. Current code is b447C.

Thank you for the photographs of the workshop manual. The ECM codes and Diagnostic code comments are quite different, no mention of "switches climate control mode to "Econ" if in auto" as in the one sent to epssax.

Might not be back with this for another week now as I am awaiting the low pressure switch and the AC man to return from his holiday.

Regards, Paul.

[Ronnie]

11 minutes ago, libstainedglass said:

The ECM codes and Diagnostic code comments are quite different, no mention of "switches climate control mode to "Econ" if in auto" as in the one sent to epssax.

Most of the codes that apply to the AC are in the BCM code charts. Take a look at the comments for the BCM codes   BTW, all the code charts can be found in the Diagnostics menu at the top of the page.

 

 

[libstainedglass]

Many Thanks for this information Ronnie.

I'll be able to give the AC man some useful pointers when I see him.

 

[Ronnie]

Thanks to 2seater for posting the FSM pages for a '90. I think they will help your mechanic sort out the problem.

[2seater]

It shouldn't make any difference, but is this an original R12 system or a R134 conversion (or something else)? Just curious what the EU is doing regarding greenhouse effects. Just an anecdotal comment, but last year when I replaced my compressor and several a/c components, I checked the static pressure of over 80psi prior to discharge and refrigerant recovery. That sounded like a good amount to me but when drained and measured there was only six tenths of a pound in the system, or about 2 pounds low. Even if they exaggerated, the system was substantially low and yet the compressor would engage??

[libstainedglass]

My Reatta was changed over to R134a in Holland where it first lived after GM imported five Reattas into Europe in 1990.

In England and presumably the EU as well, R12 was banned years ago and now all new cars must have R1234yF, which is expensive and has such small atom sizes that it is more prone to leaking away.

I stated "and presumably the EU as well" because whereas every little thing is supposed to be standardised the reality is that each country does its' own thing (especially France!).

So, when I brought my Reatta to England (an adventure in itself which I won't tell you about unless you request details of the saga) even though it had passed the compulsory Netherlands TUV safety test, I wasn't allowed to drive it over here until I had changed the lighting so that the rear indicators were separated from the brake lights and showed amber and not red. There also has to be an amber side repeater flashing in unison with the others and visible from the side/rear at an angle of 30 degrees.

I was so thankful that there isn't a CANBUS system, in fact I wouldn't have bought it if it had. I did have my heart set on a Reatta after seeing one in a magazine while visiting my daughter when she was working in America.

In addition, the seat belts must lock when given a sharp tug and the seat backs must lock when stationary, not as on the Reatta when these functions are triggered by deceleration.

It then had to pass the annual government safety check for all vehicles over three years old and I then had to prove exactly when it was manufactured (the printed label "manu 11/89" wasn't deemed good enough) and provide stacks of completed forms, import documentation,  Dutch TUV certificate, UK safety certificate, insurance documents and photographs and, of course, Money!

This application was rejected three times before it was finally given official approval.

In all, it took eight months from when I got the car home.

If you have read all this you, most likely, have lost the will to live but getting back to your question about CFCs, In England you have to have a qualification to work on aircon sytems and you are not supposed, by law, to top them up yourself. Having said that it is possible to buy cans of "top up gas" over the internet! I think they get around it by stating that the gas is not R134a but only "compatible".

Here in Europe we are all supposed to be doing everything to reduce the likelyhood of global warming, reducing consumption of plastics in packaging, promoting the sales of hybrid/electric vehicles and cutting down energy use at home with better insulation, LED lighting etc and out and about by switching off road lighting that had been installed at great expense for "safety reasons" but now is considered too expensive to run.

In my loft I have eight inches of rockwool insulation, double the recommended thickness for when my house was built in 1988. The latest spec for new homes is twelve inches, which is way below my Swedish friends house in Gothenberg.....one meter or thirty nine inches!

If you sell your house over here you have to provide an energy rating certificate. This gives an idea of how much it would cost a new owner to run the property for heating it. It also gives an estimated costing of possible improvements eg: under floor insulation, more efficient boiler, double/triple glazing, LED lighting and the savings that could made over three years. I seems to me that none of these recommendations are cost effective. For example it might state that the underfloor insulation could cost £4000-£7500, saving over three years £350-£425. Pointless!

If you have got this far then you have just wasted a chunk of your life that you will never get back!

Regards, Paul.

[2seater]

Thank you for the insight. We don't appreciate how much freedom we have from the nanny state. 

[Ronnie]

Thanks for sharing your experiences about England and the EU.  I didn't realize there were so many restrictions and regulations.  Now I understand why you are waiting for an AC mechanic to check the Freon again.

[libstainedglass]

Hello Again!

Only just got my aircon up and running last week, In time for the warmer weather but also in time for being told that I mustn't go out and about unless for an essential journey as stipulated by the government.

It took so long, not necessarily because I'm intrinsically lazy but a series of misunderstandings.

As you rightly diagnosed, there wasn't quite enough gas in the system.

Initially, we couldn't trace the leak but eventually realised that the compressor was leaking from somewhere near the middle of it.

Tried to get a rebuild gasket set in Europe but wasted weeks on promises from different companies that all came to naught.

My aircon man and I then found a $93 remanufactured one on ebay.com but they wouldn't send it to Europe and also wanted the old one back.

So...went to where I should have gone in the first place "Rock Auto"!

Bit of confusion over the correct one to order, different pulley sizes etc but they sent me a brand new "4 seasons" 3 piece kit for a reduced price, compared with compressor/receiver drier/orifice tube purchased separately and it was at my door just 5 days later! This is faster than stuff I've ordered from England. Fantastic service.

To prove that it wasn't a fluke, while fitting the new A/C stuff, I noticed that the power steering cooler was leaking so Rock Auto sent me a new generic cooler in a repeat 5 days from order to arrival. Bit fiddly to fit as both connectors are at the same end so I had to get some aluminium tubing and bend it accordingly to reverse the flow of one pipe to the other end.

All going pretty well at present. Next thing is to stop water coming in passenger side door. I made a smoke machine to locate the leak which is where the front edge of the door/bottom of glass meets the weather stripping which is split and has been masticed by a previous owner and looks a mess.

What I need is a complete replacement door seal. Is Mr Finn the man to contact?