Frogware Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 So about a year ago I started having issues with my 90' that is quickly approaching 200,000 miles. It would start up on the first crank in the morning when it was cool, but after a while of driving it would just die out of nowhere. Now I know what you are thinking and no it is not the Coil Pack since it has been upgraded to the latest and greatest and swapped out with several others to rule it out. Anyways after several months of diagnostics and a few new parts it was finally running good, so I thought. I went out a few weeks ago and tried to start her up and nothing all it would do was crank. The only thing that I hadn't checked or replaced (Because I didn't want to even go there) was the Fuel Pump. So back to no cranking I had a thought at that moment what if I gave the car a shake back and forth in the rear you know just to maybe jog the fuel pump parts around, so I did just that and when I tried to start it guess what it started right up on the first crank. What do you all think, could my fuel pump be going out Intermittently? I am worried about the troubles and woes of replacing the fuel pump, I am not as young as I use to be - ? should I do it myself or take it in to my mechanic? Oh one more thing, could some of the fuel additives of today hinder or cause parts to fail on these older in-tank pumps, just a thought? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2seater Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 It can be hard to track down intermittent problems like this, and mine reacts in a somewhat similar fashion although it always starts. I have been thinking along the same lines as you but every time I check fuel pressure, it's right where it's supposed to be. In my case, it sometimes requires an extended cranking time to fire up. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it, sometimes after sitting overnight and sometimes a warm restart after less than ten minutes. Always runs fine once started. I blame some on things that I may have done, much larger injectors, hi flow fuel pump and a chip I burned myself, but then it will start instantly time after time. It is perplexing. All that said, if this is the original fuel pump approaching 200k miles, it may be letting you know it's tired. Does it run for a few seconds consistently when you just turn the key on? My pump has about 40k miles on it and I have tried all sorts of different additives, xylene, toluene, acetone and even race gas but the pump doesn't seem to be affected but it is ten years newer than the original. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 I don't know how this will apply to a Reatta... I had a 2004 Dodge Dakota pickup with 54,000 miles that sat most of the time. I took it to Lowes one day to get some bags of mulch and parked it in the yard to unload it. Went to start it and all it would do was crank over but no start. Checked for spark and it was good so I put a fuel tester on it and found 0 fuel pressure. Had to be the fuel pump fuse right? No, the fuse was good. I crawled under the truck to see if I could hear the fuel pump running. Nope. For whatever reason I decide to slap the bottom of the tank with my hand. As soon as I did I heard the pump start running. I crawled back out and the truck started right up and did so the rest of the day while I was mulching around the house. The next morning no start until I slapped the bottom of the fuel tank and then it worked fine the rest of the day. Over the course of a few days it got to the point where the tank had to be slapped each time I started the truck. I didn't want to have to deal with dropping a tank that was full of gas in my garage so I took it to a mechanic. $234 later it was fixed with a new "fuel pump cartridge". Apparently you can't just buy a pump for a Dodge. The mechanic said it wasn't uncommon for a Dodge like mine that sits for long periods of time to have the pump go bad. I guess there is a problem with the brushes not making contact in the motor due to corrosion or something. Not long after that I sold the truck. I never liked that Dodge from the day I bought it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAVES89 Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 I got about 280,000 miles on the Red before it gave out. It was about $250.00 for pump and labor. It was last year and I was 61 and wasn't interested in crawling around under a car trying to do this. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frogware Posted August 29, 2019 Topic Author Share Posted August 29, 2019 19 hours ago, Ronnie said: I don't know how this will apply to a Reatta... I had a 2004 Dodge Dakota pickup with 54,000 miles that sat most of the time. I took it to Lowes one day to get some bags of mulch and parked it in the yard to unload it. Went to start it and all it would do was crank over but no start. Checked for spark and it was good so I put a fuel tester on it and found 0 fuel pressure. Had to be the fuel pump fuse right? No, the fuse was good. I crawled under the truck to see if I could hear the fuel pump running. Nope. For whatever reason I decide to slap the bottom of the tank with my hand. As soon as I did I heard the pump start running. I crawled back out and the truck started right up and did so the rest of the day while I was mulching around the house. The next morning no start until I slapped the bottom of the fuel tank and then it worked fine the rest of the day. Over the course of a few days it got to the point where the tank had to be slapped each time I started the truck. I didn't want to have to deal with dropping a tank that was full of gas in my garage so I took it to a mechanic. $234 later it was fixed with a new "fuel pump cartridge". Apparently you can't just buy a pump for a Dodge. The mechanic said it wasn't uncommon for a Dodge like mine that sits for long periods of time to have the pump go bad. I guess there is a problem with the brushes not making contact in the motor due to corrosion or something. Not long after that I sold the truck. I never liked that Dodge from the day I bought it. Great!!! I have a 2001 Dakota and it has given me a headache since I bought it. Hopefully I won't have issues with the fuel pump, right now it has a cooling problem and I have replaced all the parts for it so I am not sure why it still overheats ?..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frogware Posted August 29, 2019 Topic Author Share Posted August 29, 2019 18 hours ago, DAVES89 said: I got about 280,000 miles on the Red before it gave out. It was about $250.00 for pump and labor. It was last year and I was 61 and wasn't interested in crawling around under a car trying to do this. That isn't a bad price, I may just do that instead of breaking my back and saying a few things I shouldn't ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frogware Posted August 29, 2019 Topic Author Share Posted August 29, 2019 Just a little more info about this; The first time it did this the car just died when I was going about 40mph, so I quickly pulled over (remembering the day without power steering) and all it would do was crank. So I waited about 5 minutes and it started right up, and didn't have any more problems that day. After that is slowly got worse until I couldn't even drive it out of the driveway. Every time I checked the fuel pressure I was getting from 38 to as high as 45psi. About 3 months ago one time it wouldn't start I tapped on the fuel relay and it started so I thought I found the solution to all my problems and replaced all the relay's on the firewall. This was the last thing I did and thought she was a running champ, but like I said above it wouldn't start until I shook the rear-end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frogware Posted August 29, 2019 Topic Author Share Posted August 29, 2019 20 hours ago, 2seater said: My pump has about 40k miles on it and I have tried all sorts of different additives, xylene, toluene, acetone and even race gas but the pump doesn't seem to be affected but it is ten years newer than the original. Interesting you mentioned Acetone, On one of my older vehicles that I owned I remember when buying it they said that they used Acetone every time it was re-fueled. When I owned it I never had any problems with it running and continued to use Acetone because I noticed that my gas mileage would go way down if I didn't put it in. So I am wondering if I used some type of additive if it would act as a cleaning agent to maybe free up what is causing the problem. I can put 12V to the green connector to run the pump and it does without hesitation, so maybe something is stuck in there. I mean both cars do sit quite a bit especially during the winter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 12 minutes ago, Frogware said: I can put 12V to the green connector to run the pump and it does without hesitation, so maybe something is stuck in there. 30 minutes ago, Frogware said: About 3 months ago one time it wouldn't start I tapped on the fuel relay and it started so I thought I found the solution to all my problems and replaced all the relay's on the firewall. I was thinking in 90 the fuel pump relay was relocated to the interior fuse/relay block and only two relays are the firewall for the ABS and brake pump. I could be wrong but if that is true you should change the fuel pump relay and see if that fixes the problem. I would try a can of Seafoam in the tank too. It couldn't hurt. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2seater Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 The experiment with acetone was from some internet gossip that it had a positive effect on fuel atomization and good for mileage but I never saw any positive effect. A more mainstream additive as Ronnie suggests might be helpful. Quitting while running is not a good sign but it has an eerie ring to when my crank sensor had a partial failure. It went on for quite a while, acting normally, sometimes not starting, or stalling while running if I closed the hood or opened and closed the drivers door. Really weird, weird behavior that defied the common diagnosis of CPS failure. It never stayed broken and was finally replaced as a last resort. This was over five years ago and has never reoccurred, but I don't remember which engine was in the car at that time? Hotwiring the fuel pump in a non-start would eliminate any question about the relays and such. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frogware Posted August 29, 2019 Topic Author Share Posted August 29, 2019 6 hours ago, Ronnie said: I was thinking in 90 the fuel pump relay was relocated to the interior fuse/relay block and only two relays are the firewall for the ABS and brake pump. I could be wrong but if that is true you should change the fuel pump relay and see if that fixes the problem. I would try a can of Seafoam in the tank too. It couldn't hurt. Thanks Ronnie, I will have to check my manual to see if I got those relay's mixed up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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